Clever Pastor Makes Gutsy Argument Against Gay Marriage*

I’ve argued this issue for a long time, but this gutsy pastor actually lived it – in front of his City Council!

The Rev. Dr. Phil Snider of Brentwood Christian Church stood before the Springfield, Missouri City Council on August 13, 2012 and made one of the bravest 2:30 arguments against* gay marriage I’ve ever heard.

Watch the video, and then remember: when contemplating your position on social issues, you must read the Bible in the same way you must watch this video: ALL of it, all the way through TO THE END.

If you’re going to make claims about “biblical values” on social issues, you had better be prepared to use that same hermeneutic (manner of reading and interpreting the Bible) consistently on all of the Bible’s social commands. AND, you had better read ALL of the Bible, lest you make an argument on ONE social issue, and then paint yourself into a corner and force yourself to defend some abhorrent position on ANOTHER quite ‘biblical’ social issue, like slavery or the suppression of women, or genocide, or the taking of foreign women from conquered people as your wives.

I say the preacher is gutsy because he actually stood up and did it for the public record. He took the SAME religious arguments from old social issues and applied them to same sex marriage. THAT just happened!

Watch the video all the way through to the end, and you’ll see acted out what I’ve been arguing here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here and here for years now.

(HT: Matthew Paul Turner)

20 Responses

  1. […] Others have since shared the video, including Bob Cargill, who adds some further commentary and […]

  2. Whatever the issue, it doesn’t help much that his arguments were plagiarized and he admits to it only to explain his apparent confusion after the fact. Intelligent? No. Embarrassing? Yes.

  3. Kudos to the Reverend for proclaiming his beliefs, which he is most certainly entitled to do. I’m confident that all Christians do NOT live perfect lives, according to Scriptural doctrine. Still, that fact alone does NOT diminish ANY of those doctrines. They are the same – yesterday, today and tomorrow.

    That some struggle with trying to balance the truths of Scripture with the perceived need for political correctness is more a sign of the violence and hateful rhetoric that is inevitably spewed at anyone who attempts to stand up for Biblical principles.

  4. What?

    “They are the same – yesterday, today and tomorrow”???

    So the commands of God made ‘yesterday’ are still valid TODAY?
    So, you’re completely OK with: “When a man sells his daughter as a slave, she shall not go out as the male slaves do.” (Ex. 21:7)
    And still valid is the command: “Go and attack Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have; do not spare them, but kill both man and woman, child and infant, ox and sheep, camel and donkey.” (1 Sam 15:3, describing a practice we call GENOCIDE today).
    And you’re cool with: “Now therefore, kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman who has known a man by sleeping with him. But all the young girls who have not known a man by sleeping with him, keep alive for yourselves.” (Num. 31:17-18)

    The commands of God: the same yesterday, today, and tomorrow? Anything God commands is OK for eternity? It is objectively moral for eternity?

    This is the rationale of the Taliban, or some other fundamentalist psychopathic group. You endorse THIS reading of the Bible???

    And What?

    “the perceived need for political correctness is more a sign of the violence and hateful rhetoric that is inevitably spewed at anyone who attempts to stand up for Biblical principles’???

    Because I (or someone else) disagrees with your fundamentalist reading of the Bible AND provides evidence and a rational argument detailing precisely WHY your ‘yesterday, today and tomorrow’ is unacceptable EVEN AMONG MOST CHRISTIANS TODAY, that somehow is “violence and hateful rhetoric that is inevitably spewed at anyone who attempts to stand up for Biblical principles”???

    Seriously? I’m pointing out how your logic plays out, and somehow I’m hateful and violent for pointing out the flaws in your fundamentalist logic, which thinks slavery, murder, kidnapping of foreigners as wives, and genocide is OK because God said to do it???

    Again, to all who read: you must THINK your theological positions THROUGH to their ENDS. Pretend you’re playing chess. You can’t just make one move (i.e., the Bible says X, so I have to do X yesterday, today and tomorrow), and not think about how making that one move (i.e., interpreting that text in that manner) will play out throughout the rest of the game.

    Good grief.

  5. Ennis, methinks you missed the point. I’ll go ahead and explain it.
    The entire point of the exercise was for the people to think that he was making a strong case against gay marriage, and then, in the middle, reveal to the people that he was simply parroting the SAME arguments that were made against desegregation. Anyone who was saying, “AMEN, That’s right! Preach it!” then has to admit that they would have “Amen’d” segregation.
    It was a series of quotes.
    If all you’ve got is a phoney charge of plagiarism, then my readers can see how weak the argument against same-sex marriage really is.

  6. A great sarcastic speech that I fear the point will be entirely missed by the willfully ignorant.

  7. agreed (unfortunately).

  8. I wasn’t arguing for or against any social issue nor did anything I say imply disagreement with or misunderstanding of your post. Without plainly saying so I was bemoaning the fact that Christians often do nothing more than parrot, in this case plagiarize, what others say. Not a healthy way to approach a debate.

    I’m surprised you got so much meaning out of what I didn’t say :)

  9. Ennis, he wasn’t plagiarizing. He was presenting arguments made 60 years ago, and then demonstrating how, while they were absurd when used arguing FOR segregation, many still use them to argue AGAINST same-sex marriage.

    Again, if you think what he did is ‘plagiarism’, then I’m more worried about the meaning of the things you DO say.


  10. This is really getting off topic but explain why repeating another person’s arguments, without attribution, giving the impression they are your own, is not plagiarism. He only admitted they weren’t his ideas to explain why he messed up.

    And I agree. Repeating arguments used against racism – entirely unsustainable – in the debate about same sex marriage kills the argument anyway.

    But isn’t that also obvious?

  11. IT WAS GAG! He was reading from a script. He ‘messed up’ on purpose! He read the old segregation arguments, got those opposed to gay marriage people to ‘buy in’ to the argument, and then revealed that he was ACTUALLY reading arguments FOR SEGREGATION. That’s the power of the speech. That’s the power of the argument: he messed up on purpose.

    So, no, it’s not so obvious to some…

  12. Well the laugh is on me. Please accept my most sincere and humble apology. Satire is usually lost on me. I never see it coming or going.

    Thanks for enduring my nonsense.

  13. First, let me say that my son is gay, I am a local PFLAG chapter president, and I subscribe to Bob’s blog, and enjoy it immensely. I am also a UU, and think that’s where Bob belongs. As for the video clip, since the astute Reverend used a script from the civil rights era, there was plagiarism involved. However, that has no bearing on using it with skilled sarcasm to make his “real” point which I believe those in the room understood…Hats off to him and all those who really follow the teachings of Jesus…..

  14. Gutsy. If you don’t look past the literal word, Biblical support can be found for so much injustice, including injustices such as slavery and second class views of women. Conservative evangelicals fought against women’s suggrage in state and church. Some evangelicals no longer oppose gay marriage, so viewpoints are changing.

  15. Kudos to Ennis for his graceful apology.

  16. Agreed. Hear, hear. I can’t tell you how many times I’ve missed the joke in online discussions.


  18. agreed, and this is a good thing.

  19. […] watched this video the other day from Robert Cargill’s site (he makes a great point about it over there, you should check it out).  Watch the entire video […]

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